Post by Alien Dave on Jan 11, 2014 19:01:04 GMT
An odd one this. The list of anti-aircraft fire modifiers actually precludes you shooting down helicopters with IR guided SAMS.
Historically, I think the Taliban and Olly North would have something to say about this. Or the rangers in Somalia (and that was an RPG (classed as a LAW in TW)).
Below is the list of modifiers for shooting at aircraft (including helos) from the book
1. -1, if using non-specialist AA elements with SA, AC or TG
2. -1 if firing element is suppressed
3. -1 if shooting at helo performing a 'pop-up' manoeuvre
4. +1 if shooting at transport helos
5. +1 if using AC >20mm calibre
6. +2 if using RADAR guided SAMs vs planes (not helos)
7. +2 if firing at transport planes
The situation we had was I tried shooting down a German attack helo with a Russian IR guided vehicle launched SAM.
Target number was 2.
1. I was using a specialist AA element. No modifier
2. I was not suppressed. No modifier
3. The helo was in plain sight, not popping up. No modifier
4. The target was an attack helo, not a transport. No modifier
5. Firing a missile, so not applicable
6. SAM was IR guided. No modifier
7. Target was an attack helo, so not applicable.
So, after all that I had to get a 2 or less. The problem comes when you realise that the target number is to force an aircraft/helo to ABORT HIS ATTACK RUN. You have to get 2 under the target number to shoot him down!
This left me with a 20% chance of scaring off the helo, and absolutely no chance to shoot him down, something we all found a little odd.
I propose we add one more modifier, similar to line 6 above:
+2 if using IR guided SAMs vs helos (not planes)
The modifier may sound like it's a bit much, but consider this: An AA/SAM element is 3-4 vehicles, a helo/plane element is 1 aircraft, so you have, in effect, up to four weapon systems engaging that one a/c.
This will make IR SAMs a bit more deadly (20% abort run plus 20% shoot down chance) and force you to take advantage of the 'pop-up' maneuver to get an additional -1 modifier, thus emulating what happens in the real world. I have left out them getting a bonus against planes as planes are typically a lot faster than helos and IR guided SAMs have a comparatively small attack envelope. Helos do not suffer the +2 modifier when being attacked by RADAR guided SAMs as they typically operate down in the weeds where radars have difficulty getting a lock (although it is not impossible - ask me for a lesson on radar theory sometime!!!)
DW
Historically, I think the Taliban and Olly North would have something to say about this. Or the rangers in Somalia (and that was an RPG (classed as a LAW in TW)).
Below is the list of modifiers for shooting at aircraft (including helos) from the book
1. -1, if using non-specialist AA elements with SA, AC or TG
2. -1 if firing element is suppressed
3. -1 if shooting at helo performing a 'pop-up' manoeuvre
4. +1 if shooting at transport helos
5. +1 if using AC >20mm calibre
6. +2 if using RADAR guided SAMs vs planes (not helos)
7. +2 if firing at transport planes
The situation we had was I tried shooting down a German attack helo with a Russian IR guided vehicle launched SAM.
Target number was 2.
1. I was using a specialist AA element. No modifier
2. I was not suppressed. No modifier
3. The helo was in plain sight, not popping up. No modifier
4. The target was an attack helo, not a transport. No modifier
5. Firing a missile, so not applicable
6. SAM was IR guided. No modifier
7. Target was an attack helo, so not applicable.
So, after all that I had to get a 2 or less. The problem comes when you realise that the target number is to force an aircraft/helo to ABORT HIS ATTACK RUN. You have to get 2 under the target number to shoot him down!
This left me with a 20% chance of scaring off the helo, and absolutely no chance to shoot him down, something we all found a little odd.
I propose we add one more modifier, similar to line 6 above:
+2 if using IR guided SAMs vs helos (not planes)
The modifier may sound like it's a bit much, but consider this: An AA/SAM element is 3-4 vehicles, a helo/plane element is 1 aircraft, so you have, in effect, up to four weapon systems engaging that one a/c.
This will make IR SAMs a bit more deadly (20% abort run plus 20% shoot down chance) and force you to take advantage of the 'pop-up' maneuver to get an additional -1 modifier, thus emulating what happens in the real world. I have left out them getting a bonus against planes as planes are typically a lot faster than helos and IR guided SAMs have a comparatively small attack envelope. Helos do not suffer the +2 modifier when being attacked by RADAR guided SAMs as they typically operate down in the weeds where radars have difficulty getting a lock (although it is not impossible - ask me for a lesson on radar theory sometime!!!)
DW