Balgin
Wyvern
Raphael
Posts: 536
|
Post by Balgin on Dec 8, 2014 10:31:37 GMT
Yep. It's that "decent pool of models that aren't in her starting box" which makes her harder to play by their absence .
|
|
masterdisaster
Padawan
Will McCreath - Wyrd Henchman & Malifaux Junkie
Posts: 467
|
Post by masterdisaster on Dec 8, 2014 12:24:20 GMT
The major issue you will have with Colette is her "current" starter box isn't at all current. It's the old metal box and therefor isn't balanced at the M2E level. There has been no word or sightings of a plastic box for her in the near future and this means I cannot reliably recommend a set of models to start with (although I could try!) and this is most likely why you have been struggling to get much done with the models you currently own. At best the Malifaux community can speculate what it will be like and which models will be included when it finally arrives however this doesn't solve the problem you are having. Ideally you'd need to add Angelica and 2x Coryphee + the Duet to make some serious headway however I've read many good things about the Mechanical Rider, Howard Langston, Joss and other heavy hitters working alongside Colette. These are models you do not currently own and will prove to be somewhat difficult to get unless you pick up Ramos' box for Joss and Langston or try to source from the dark recesses of the internet the old metals. Colette actually works a LOT better with non thematic models by her side, this isn't to say she is bad with the thematic show girls but some of her more competitive options are not showgirls.
For the sake of your own sanity I'd recommend going with the Viktoria's for the league, you already have the vast majority of their models that are included in their starter box. You'd need both Viks, Taelor, 3x Ronin and the Student of Conflict. This is a great starting point to expand on. You have a little experience with the crew and you will find them a little more straight forward than Colette. Leveticus may not be a wise choice to begin with, his starter box is very limited in terms of options. Abominations are OK as far as minions go but you might not be in a position to add some of the bigger more threatening models for a while due to points limitations.
Of course the decision is totally up to you but I believe if you feel this way now you may feel even worse a few months into the league when everybody seems to be progressing fairly quickly with their crews and you're still struggling with fundamentals of Colette because you're getting pummeled each game by a wall of bullets or nasty beat sticks. You need to be sure the Master and crew you decide to go with is one you are happy to play with for a while because changing them mid-league wont be an option and I'd hate to see people drop out of the league because they aren't happy with the way their performance is going.
|
|
Balgin
Wyvern
Raphael
Posts: 536
|
Post by Balgin on Dec 8, 2014 14:52:25 GMT
Is there a master who's immune to bullets?
|
|
masterdisaster
Padawan
Will McCreath - Wyrd Henchman & Malifaux Junkie
Posts: 467
|
Post by masterdisaster on Dec 8, 2014 15:47:01 GMT
Is there a master who's immune to bullets? Uhhh... No. You will need to get used to being turned into Swiss Cheese I'm afraid. Well... That or find a way to counter them, most factions have some pretty decent anti-shooting tools at their disposal. As a side note I have finally decided on the crew I will be taking, I know I said I was going to wait a while but I can't see many more people joining in at this point (It would be nice though!) although my Mrs and friend Joe have both said they'd happily get in on this. Joe will be a nice addition as he introduced me to taught me how to play Malifaux (he was also at one time an official Wyrd Henchman) so having a 2nd veteran in the league will make my life a little easier in regards to managing rules queries etc. Also the Mrs puts up a pretty stiff fight and has taken to Malifaux pretty well. So rather than copping out and picking a Master I already own and have a little experience with I've decided to jump into a faction I have very little experience with and against as well as a Master I only have a rudimentary understanding of. I will happily change this decision if somebody wants to play her instead but for the time being I can't resist buying the Lilith box, those Nephilim are too cool to pass up! Take her for the League or not, I must own those models. Worst case scenario I have 2 back up Masters in mind in case anybody wants to steal Lilith from me. I've got a part painted Ressurectionist crew who I've been meaning to learn more and an Outcast crew who I've dabbled with and should be fairly easy to paint up.
|
|
masterdisaster
Padawan
Will McCreath - Wyrd Henchman & Malifaux Junkie
Posts: 467
|
Post by masterdisaster on Dec 9, 2014 16:32:28 GMT
As a quick reminder to any who have signed up to the league and want a refresher / beginner game in the new year. I only have 1 date left in January, check out my Calendar here. If you want a 1 on 1 be quick and get in there. I'm also happy to run a game for you and another so ask the other guys who are booked in and see if they mind. I'm happy to give up a game one week or two if it benefits the league and the members in it.
|
|
|
Post by madphil101 on Dec 13, 2014 18:01:19 GMT
If I manage to free up my Mondays and come along I'll gladly play but I'm too flaky (and not competitive enough) to join the league. I have a full painted kr case of folks. I've been training with Tony and can honestly say the gremlins are a nightmare.
I've been rotating the crews I reckon we are on game 6 and I've not repeated a master. I've not got much in the way of extras, but I have lots of starters.
|
|
|
Post by stubram on Dec 14, 2014 0:28:11 GMT
League RosterWill (MasterDisaster) Faction: Neverborn Master: Lilith
Tom (Elmo) Faction: Guild Master: Sonnia Matt (comstar) Faction: Guild Master: Perdita Ortega Tony (tony74) Faction: Gremlins Master: OpheliaMike (piggiemike) Faction: Arcanists Master: RamosRaph (balgin) Faction Arcanists Master : Colette du BoisSimon (Simonkretz) Faction: TBC Master: TBC Sign me up dude. Stu, Resurrectionist, Seamus.
|
|
masterdisaster
Padawan
Will McCreath - Wyrd Henchman & Malifaux Junkie
Posts: 467
|
Post by masterdisaster on Dec 15, 2014 9:04:25 GMT
madphil101 The idea of the league isn't really to be a tournament level competition. It's just a little bit of fun and a great way to ease people into the game whilst playing new opponents and building up a cool Malifaux crew. It's not going to be break neck and cut throat gaming. That's not what I'm about and I don't really encourage that sort of gaming either. You are welcome to pick up a spot in the league and just go for the fun of it however if you want to just play some games and no bother with the league that's fine. I've got a few tricks up my sleeve for dealing with those pesky Gremlins. Lilith is the Master of Malifaux! If she can't handle them then nobody can! stubram Done! Signed up. Still... you have now taken the spot as filth monger of the League with Tony trailing closely behind you... Damn Gremlins! Sure they die in droves but there is SOOO many of them! The League roster is starting to look pretty good with all but 2 factions being represented. Come on people! Where is the love for Ten Thunders or Outcasts?! My beloved Outcasts have been.. well... Outcast! It's a shame they are my primary faction otherwise I'd take them into the League but I know my Outcast crews inside out and probably wouldn't be all that fair
|
|
masterdisaster
Padawan
Will McCreath - Wyrd Henchman & Malifaux Junkie
Posts: 467
|
Post by masterdisaster on Dec 15, 2014 10:31:21 GMT
Just a quick update. I have created the first Arrange a Game thread for the League. I will do this on a monthly basis so we can keep track of who is playing who. Please use these threads for all of your Ranked Games so that I can manage numbers and liaise with Chaz to manage table space. Please try to get these booked in advance so we can make sure everybody who wants to play gets a table. If you want to get your first official League game booked in here is the place to go.
|
|
|
Post by madphil101 on Dec 15, 2014 21:33:55 GMT
Ok well if I come I'm happy to limit myself to outcasts. I'll take Tara. I've got the viks set painted and Von schill is done in metal so I don't have the travelling trunk. I've got a big mk1 Leviticus crew too but they aren't easy to see how they'll work yet.
Tara looks like she requires finesse... I'm sure I can make a fist of that! Now I need to commit to getting to the club.
|
|
masterdisaster
Padawan
Will McCreath - Wyrd Henchman & Malifaux Junkie
Posts: 467
|
Post by masterdisaster on Dec 16, 2014 8:21:11 GMT
Tara!? You... Want.. To... Use... Tara?!?! That woman is nuts! She's not particularly beginner friendly but then saying that Tony has Ophelia, Matt has Perdita and Stu is going with Seamus. Screw it! BRING ALL THE FILTH!! Come one come all! In all seriousness you are right. Tara does require some finesse to get to grips with, she's one of my favorite Masters alongside The Viks, McCabe and Hoffman. Her bury mechanics combined with the time control things she can do are very unusual. Leveticus on the other hand is much more simple than his previous incarnation however his starter box seems lacking and you may find yourself needing more for the first couple of months of the league. Are you one of the lucky few who can actually say they own Tara's boxset? I know I am and they are some really cool models although Karina is a tad boring, The Nothing Beast is pretty awesome though! With the inclusion of Outcasts the only crew yet to be represented is Ten Thunders, those poor little blighters. It would be nice to see a Ten Thunders crew show up but with 6 out of 7 factions having some table time a lot of different play styles will crop up which is nice.
|
|
|
Post by madphil101 on Dec 16, 2014 20:21:11 GMT
Tara is owned, glued, based, sprayed but unpainted. That was my reason for choosing her. My viks crew is painted Leviticus is sprayed and I've almost done the abominations. I'm sorely tempted by buying misaki or Mei feng but on the basis that it would leave the outcasts unrepresented I figured it would be as good to stay outcast.
If you think Tara will skew it I'll take something else. I'm happy to go with pretty much any crew other than Marcus. (He's the only one that doesn't inspire me) or lady justice.(I can't find her plastic kit)
|
|
masterdisaster
Padawan
Will McCreath - Wyrd Henchman & Malifaux Junkie
Posts: 467
|
Post by masterdisaster on Dec 17, 2014 8:51:07 GMT
Tara can be horrendously aggressive with her play style and although it is really fun from the players point of view at times I've caused rage quitting with Tara , she is prone to causing some NPE's if your opponent is new or isn't expecting her typical combo's or play style. A lot of my friends have put Tara on a ban list along with my McCabe because they don't like how nasty they can be (or how nasty I play with them). It's totally up to you though, you go with a Master you are happy with. If you were to go with Mei Feng or Misaki I'd encourage the Ten Thunders side of them rather than their alternative factions. Purely because if you were to leave Outcasts (which Raph might be taking if he can't get into Colette) then at least the other unrepresented Faction would have a champion. Tara's starter box is actually really good for it's cost, you get some great models but their mechanics can be a little weird to get your head around and can be pretty frustrating if your going up against them for the first time. I don't mind though, I know how to counter them. I'll leave it in your hands to decide. I honestly don't mind either way, just play nice with Tara
|
|
|
Post by madphil101 on Dec 17, 2014 16:23:41 GMT
As Tony will vouch for I play fun not brutal. My games usually involve winning until the last moment when I throw it all away in a stupid moment of playing in the spirit...
|
|
masterdisaster
Padawan
Will McCreath - Wyrd Henchman & Malifaux Junkie
Posts: 467
|
Post by masterdisaster on Dec 17, 2014 16:52:07 GMT
My games usually involve winning until the last moment when I throw it all away in a stupid moment of playing in the spirit... You sir are preaching to the choir!
|
|
|
Post by madphil101 on Dec 18, 2014 0:17:45 GMT
Ok. We did Tara vs seamus. Seemed ok. Tara activating twice is a bit cheeky but not so much as to be broken. No worse than rotten belles leaping across the board to sybelle or that bloody pounce.
I haven't worked out how to really USE bury. I've got the mechanism but not how to make use of it. I think it needs extras (death marshals, killjoy, ashes and dust, bĂȘte noire) to really make them broken. Not established what Latinas role as a totem is yet either. She's an odd one, more of a minion?
Right so it brought Tony and I on to summoning. I think you mentioned it somewhere but I couldn't see it: Are you just limited to deploying one box but if you summon a death Marshall with a red joker that's ok, or are you completely limited to one box. Someone has Lilith and she can evolve her crew. Is that allowed? And are you limited to the upgrades in the starter?
|
|
masterdisaster
Padawan
Will McCreath - Wyrd Henchman & Malifaux Junkie
Posts: 467
|
Post by masterdisaster on Dec 18, 2014 9:02:28 GMT
Oh ho ho ho! I can teach you how to REALLY abuse that bury mechanic of hers. It's capable of some seriously horrible alpha strike style combos. I've landed a seriously pissed off Killjoy onto my opponents Master on turn 1 whilst they were still in their deployment zone before, that caused a rage quit unsurprisingly. Tara get's pretty ridiculous when you get to grips with her. She's not quite as obnoxious as Seamus when you start getting into some of his shenanigans though. He has a combo affectionately known as "The Terror Bomb" which is pretty unpleasant if you are on the receiving end of it. I have, hence my undying hatred for him! Tara tends to use her bury mechanic to bury somebody and give them fast (Friend or foe, it doesn't matter) then later she can bring them back up, under her control and send them off to murder things or complete objectives. It doesn't require any additional models to do although the Death Marshall's make life a little easier, Bete Noir is not particularly synergistic with Tara contrary to what people say. Just because she can bury and unbury herself doesn't make her particularly efficient with Tara although she isn't a bad model. Killjoy is a popular choice because he's badass and can start the game buried and Tara can bypass the unbury requirements of having one of your own models killed to get him back. Ashes and Dust also doesn't really seem to want to be buried, he's better of charging down one side of the board killing anything in his path, that way if it dies and splits into it's separate parts it can reform much quicker and get back into the action. Karina is a pretty crappy totem in all fairness, without her new upgrade she is all but useless. She has some great actions which can be used on buried models and she's pretty good at shooting but many feel at 5ss she is over costed. Her new upgrade mitigates this somewhat but she's still not the favorite. Many people use the Student of Conflict or Malifaux Child with Tara because they are cheaper and you get more mileage out of them in the long run. Karina is actually an Enforcer and a Totem so she can take 1 upgrade but often it just makes an already expensive model even more pricey! In terms of summoning the rules are in the original post of this thread however I'll go over them for you here. Summons are incredibly powerful and so in order to limit them and prevent mainly the Ressurectionists but also a handful of other summoners stomping everything in their path during the League I've implemented a "Model Pool" restriction system. This has 2 main reasons, firstly to curb summoners and also to prevent people from trashing face because they have more money for models or just more models in general to summon in. Additionally it also puts everybody on a more fair and even playing field as most people will have the same or similar number of models to work with making it a little fairer. What this means to begin with is you can only use the models within your starer box. For you this means Tara, Karina, The Nothing Beast and 3x Void Wretches. You will only be able to summon models from that selection of models because that is all you have in your "Model Pool". After the first escalation from 30ss to 35ss you can add one box/blister or individual model from a different starter set into your "Model Pool" (in case of multiples such as minions who aren't available in their own box yet you can add them all, Torakage are a good example of this) This means once the new models are in your Pool you can summon or hire them as and when you like but can only use those models. Lilith's Growth mechanic is no different to this, it is effectively a type of summoning although a much more difficult to achieve and unconventional way of going about it. (It's me playing Lilith by the way). As I will only have 3 Terror Tots to begin with and no Young or Mature Nephilim to evolve them into I will not be able to use the Growth mechanics until a later date when I can add those models to my Pool. With Tara and Karina you will be in a similar boat. For the first two months you will not have Death Marshall's in your Model Pool and therefor Karina will not be able to summon them until you add Death Marshalls to your Model Pool. The ONLY exception to this is models that are fundamentally needed to ensure certain mechanics work. This includes things such as Mindless Zombies, Seishin, Electrical Creations etc. These kind of models are often limited by the upgrade that allows their summon or required to make a Master's actions work. They rarely impact the game in a massive way and so if you're Master can use these there will be no restriction on them, you are assumed to have them in your Pool already. Kirai is incredibly dependent on her Seishin so restricting her is like kicking her in the crotch. Nicodem often relies heavily on Mindless Zombies. It's optional in his case but still if people want to play that way or use them I wont limit their Mindless Zombies, they suck! However if they aren't all fully painted they wont achieve the bonus point each match so it's actually more work for them. Lastly, upgrades! There is no restrictions on upgrades. So long as they are allowed to be taken by your crew and you allocate them to the appropriate models you can take any upgrades you wish. This includes master specific AND generic faction upgrades so go nuts with those! Does that clear it up for you?
|
|
|
Post by Anything Green or Mean! on Dec 18, 2014 15:30:35 GMT
Don't forget Somer from the Gremlins for summoning lol
|
|
masterdisaster
Padawan
Will McCreath - Wyrd Henchman & Malifaux Junkie
Posts: 467
|
Post by masterdisaster on Dec 18, 2014 15:36:54 GMT
Don't forget Somer from the Gremlins for summoning lol There's a bunch of summoners. Every Resser Master except Tara can summon (Her totem is the Summoner in that crew), Saying that even Tara can summon if she takes the Spare Parts upgrade which any Rezzer Master can take. The Dreamer, Ramos, Som'er, Kaeris, Sonnia & Lilith are all Masters who can summon in one shape or form. Some other models such as Toshiro, The Mechnaical Rider and the Witchling Handler can also summon in various ways too. There's probably one or two others who can summon stuff so it's fairly common but if left unrestricted especially at lower point games it can seriously unbalance the game.
|
|
|
Post by piggiemike on Dec 18, 2014 22:42:36 GMT
Nigel isnt on the forums but would like to join in with Lucius. Not entirely sure which faction he is going with though. Also, Keith hasnt signed up but im sure he wants to really. Will pester him on messenger.
|
|
|
Post by madphil101 on Dec 19, 2014 6:11:14 GMT
Oh ho ho ho! I can teach you how to REALLY abuse that bury mechanic... Tara tends to use her bury mechanic to bury somebody and give them fast (Friend or foe) The abuse I could seemed to be through building a crew out of deploying killjoy directly into the enemy (but I could see simpler ways to do that) and I think that's a killjoy thing as much as anything. How does Tara bury her own crew without punching them?
|
|
masterdisaster
Padawan
Will McCreath - Wyrd Henchman & Malifaux Junkie
Posts: 467
|
Post by masterdisaster on Dec 19, 2014 9:13:30 GMT
The Killjoy thing works with pretty much any heavy hitting model with Tara.
There are 2 main ways for Tara to bury stuff. Firstly she uses Pull the Void on the to deal 1 Dmg and give them Slow / Fast (naturally you choose Fast!) after doing this you trigger the built in Trigger "Glimpse the Void" to bury them so long as they fail a Wp duel which seeing as they are friendly they can choose to relent and automatically fail. Tara's crew can only use this Trigger if there is nothing buried already. You can bypass this restriction if you give the Nothing Beast it's new upgrade giving it a 10" aura so that models within the aura can ignore this restriction. It's fairly limited because the Nothing Beast is kind of fragile and likes to be buried and unburied to launch it's attacks although the new upgrade offers it some durability as well.
The alternative is to take the Dead of Winter upgrade allowing Tara to hire Void Wretches, Nothing Beast AND Death Marshalls regardless of her Faction or theirs. Then use Death Marshalls to Pinebox stuff. This deals no Dmg and just requires the target to fail a Wp duel. In order to bury 2 models at a time or more you must use the Glimpse the Void trigger which is available on pretty much all her thematic crew on you're first target then have Dead Marshalls Pinebox stuff after. This upgrade also offers an alternative way to use Tara by using the Fast condition in an offensive manor. Enemies with Fast within 6" of Tara get -2 Wp which is great for all Tara's Wp based attacks and tricks. I've used it to great effect in the past, by getting within 6" of an enemy that has yet to activate you can hit it with Pull the Void to deal 1 Dmg and Fast (it then gains -2 Wp) after this trigger Glimpse the Void and force a Wp test at -2 to bury it. Later you can unbury it under your control to make it attack the enemy with 3 AP or copy it's abilities. both of these tactics require different upgrades but are both pretty fun!
|
|
masterdisaster
Padawan
Will McCreath - Wyrd Henchman & Malifaux Junkie
Posts: 467
|
Post by masterdisaster on Dec 22, 2014 15:15:15 GMT
Nigel isnt on the forums but would like to join in with Lucius. Not entirely sure which faction he is going with though. Also, Keith hasnt signed up but im sure he wants to really. Will pester him on messenger. I've signed Nigel up with Lucius, if you can let me know what Faction he will be taking as and when you can that would be great.
|
|
|
Post by farseerjoe on Dec 29, 2014 13:29:49 GMT
Having had a look think I'm going to go with Ten Thunders with Lucas McCabe. Just need to go and buy it now!
|
|
masterdisaster
Padawan
Will McCreath - Wyrd Henchman & Malifaux Junkie
Posts: 467
|
Post by masterdisaster on Jan 1, 2015 16:24:59 GMT
Having had a look think I'm going to go with Ten Thunders with Lucas McCabe. Just need to go and buy it now! Great stuff, I've replied to your message. I'll sign you upto the league.
|
|